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SALMAN RUSHDIE: Bartleby,
quick, I am waiting.

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I heard a slow scrape
of his chair legs

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on the uncarpeted floor.

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And soon he appeared standing at
the entrance of his hermitage.

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What is wanted, said he mildly.

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The copies, the copies,
said I hurriedly.

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We're going to
examine them there.

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And I held towards him
the fourth quadruplicate.

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I would prefer not to, he
said, and gently disappeared

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behind the screen.

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For a few moments, I was
turned into a pillar of salt,

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standing at the head of my
seated column of cloaks.

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standing at the head of my
seated column of cloaks.

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Recovering myself, I
advanced towards the screen

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and demanded the reason for
such extraordinary conduct.

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Why do you refuse?

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I would prefer not to.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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What is something
unusual about them?

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What is something
unusual about them?

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When Joyce introduces
Leopold Bloom in "Ulysses,"

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he starts with the
sentence, "Mr. Leopold Bloom

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age with relish the inner
organs of beasts and fowls."

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The fact that he likes
offal, that he likes tripe,

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that he likes et
cetera, all that,

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you kind of almost immediately
have a sense of him

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because of what he eats,
which is not usual,

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because of what he eats,
which is not usual,

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certainly not to me.

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I mean, I'm not a big
fan of the inner organs

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of beasts and fowls.

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But I love it that he is.

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You need to come up with
some aspect of your character

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that is idiosyncratic, that
not everybody would share,

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that is special
to that character.

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And start there.

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Then you can broaden it
into all sorts of things.

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If there's a character with
green hair, tell us that first.

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I think in Isabel Allende's
"House of the Spirits,"

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I think in Isabel Allende's
"House of the Spirits,"

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there's a character
with green hair.

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And she puts it right up front.

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You're immediately intrigued.

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When you begin a book, and the
reader can sit there and think,

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well the books that think,
you want to intrigue them

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so that they want the journey.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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The decision between the
first and third person

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is really the question
about whether you

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is really the question
about whether you

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want to have your reader see
your character from the outside

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and only gradually
penetrate to the deeper

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layers of the character or
whether you want your reader

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to see the character
from the inside, see them

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as they see themselves,
and then for your reader

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to decide whether
the way the character

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presents himself or
herself is truthful.

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If you're using the first
person, you're usually saying,

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If you're using the first
person, you're usually saying,

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trust me, I'm your storyteller.

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But if your
storyteller is a liar,

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then they're
presenting themselves

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in a way that is false.

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And what you as
the author can do

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is begin to point
the reader to see

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the discrepancies
between the way

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in which the character
is describing themselves

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and how other people
might see that character.

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and how other people
might see that character.

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There can be parts of a
book which are subjective,

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written through the first
person view of the character,

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and others which
are objective, which

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come outside the character
and look at it from outside.

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You can have novels in
which there's more than one

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first person character and in
which the different narrators

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don't always see the
story the same way.

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There are some books which
have, really, multiple narrators

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William Faulkner's "As I Lay
Dying" is like a relay race,

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William Faulkner's "As I Lay
Dying" is like a relay race,

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where the narrator changes
almost with every chapter.

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And what that does in
the end is to give you

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almost a collective
community view of the story.

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So yeah, I would suggest
experimenting with all this.

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It's worth getting the hang
of all these different things

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because it gives you a toolbox.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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Essentially, you have three
ways of revealing character.

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You can either reveal character
through what they say.

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If they say some
terrible things,

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then you know that kind
of terrible person.

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If you're writing
another kind of book,

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you can reveal character
through interior monologue.

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You can tell the
reader what is going on

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inside the character's head.

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And the third thing is
you can reveal character

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through action,
through what they do.

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As in real life,
sometimes in a book

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there is a discrepancy
between what people say

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there is a discrepancy
between what people say

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and what they do.

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When Ralph Ellison
writes "Invisible Man,"

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he's entirely inside
his character.

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And he sees the whole world
from inside his character.

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And so the way in which
we learn the character

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is through, as it were,
his own self-portrait.

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That's great.

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I mean, I actually
love that book.

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And I think first person
narration gives you

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the gift of going inside,
of writing from inside,

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looking out.

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looking out.

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Hemingway is like this, where
almost everything is revealed

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through action,
action and dialogue

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because Hemingway uses
a lot of dialogue.

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It's almost all about
what people are doing.

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There's very little in Hemingway
of people reflecting inwardly

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about themselves.

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It's all out there.

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They're drinking.

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They're going to bullfights.

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They're having sex
with each other.

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They're misbehaving
in various ways.

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They're expressing anti-Semitic
sentiments in some cases.

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You judge them by what
they say and what they do.

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I think it's very interesting
in third person narration

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I think it's very interesting
in third person narration

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to create this tension
between how people speak

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about themselves and what they
want and what they actually do.

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Hypocrisy is one of the
great things revealed

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by that discrepancy,
people who say one thing

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and do another
thing is often what

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you would call a hypocrite.

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In Moliere's play
"Tartuffe," you

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have the central
character who speaks

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in very holy, moral language,
behaves in an absolutely

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in very holy, moral language,
behaves in an absolutely

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creepy and dreadful way.

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The entire play is about the
discrepancy between the way

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he portrays himself to the
world and what he actually is.

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"It is a science to stretch
out the strings of conscience

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in the service of diverse things
and to rectify an evil action

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with the purity
of our intention.

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Regarding these secrets,
I shall instruct you.

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You need only to allow
me to conduct you.

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You need only to allow
me to conduct you.

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Satisfy my desire
and have no fear.

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I'll assume the sin and
leave your soul clear."

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In the end, he's exposed
for being a fraud.

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So yeah, you got
those three things.

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And it's, again, a question of
deciding, for your story, which

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is the best way.

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If, for example,
in your story, you

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don't want to give away a
character's secrets right away,

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don't want to give away a
character's secrets right away,

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if there are things you want
to withhold from the reader

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until a dramatic moment
when you will reveal them,

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then it's best to write
the story in such a way

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that the character is
revealed through action.

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If you want to write a novel
of inner life, then sometimes

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first person narrative is
the best way to try that.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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The thing about
dialogue is you have

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The thing about
dialogue is you have

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to decide what dialogue
is doing in the story.

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00:08:04,461 --> 00:08:06,141
There are stories
which are almost

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00:08:06,141 --> 00:08:09,251
all dialogue, in
which everything

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00:08:09,251 --> 00:08:12,191
about the characters
and the events

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00:08:12,191 --> 00:08:15,851
is told through how
people talk to each other.

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And there are stories in which
people speak very little,

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but when they speak,
it's very important.

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So just to take
those to extremes,

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there's a wonderful
story that Susan Sontag

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wrote in the early days
of the AIDS crisis.

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It was a story called
"The Way We Live Now."

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It was a story called
"The Way We Live Now."

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And in the story, the central
character who never appears

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is somebody who
obviously has got AIDS.

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And the story is
about this whole group

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of people who know him,
talking to each other.

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And each of them talks to each
other in a kind of circle.

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And the space in the
middle, the thing not said,

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the thing not seen is
the person the story

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is about who's dying of AIDS.

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00:09:00,021 --> 00:09:00,981
is about who's dying of AIDS.

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And there, dialogue is used to
reveal a whole social problem.

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00:09:05,661 --> 00:09:08,541
In the early days of AIDS when
there was a stigma about it,

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00:09:08,541 --> 00:09:10,491
people were obviously
very afraid.

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00:09:10,491 --> 00:09:15,051
And all of that gets revealed
through the way in which people

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talk about the absent person.

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00:09:16,438 --> 00:09:18,771
How do you talk about somebody
when they leave the room?

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00:09:18,771 --> 00:09:23,341
And there are other stories
in which very little is said,

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00:09:23,341 --> 00:09:25,531
but what is said is
incredibly significant.

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00:09:25,531 --> 00:09:28,561
In Herman Melville's story
"Bartleby," just about the only

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00:09:28,561 --> 00:09:30,021
thing that Bartleby says
is I prefer not to when

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00:09:30,021 --> 00:09:32,641
thing that Bartleby says
is I prefer not to when

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00:09:32,641 --> 00:09:33,901
he's asked to do things.

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00:09:33,901 --> 00:09:35,901
He prefers not to.

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00:09:35,901 --> 00:09:38,361
And Melville in a
way never tells us

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00:09:38,361 --> 00:09:41,271
why it is that he
constantly refuses,

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00:09:41,271 --> 00:09:43,641
even when refusing to
do things is actually

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00:09:43,641 --> 00:09:45,141
against his interest.

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00:09:45,141 --> 00:09:49,521
But it makes him this
extraordinarily enigmatic

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00:09:49,521 --> 00:09:55,061
figure and kind of almost
emblematic figure of refusing,

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00:09:55,061 --> 00:09:57,221
the person who says no.

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00:09:57,221 --> 00:10:00,021
And there, the enormously
condensed use of dialogue,

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00:10:00,021 --> 00:10:01,751
And there, the enormously
condensed use of dialogue,

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00:10:01,751 --> 00:10:06,291
almost to that single sentence,
tells you a huge amount.

208
00:10:06,291 --> 00:10:08,261
So again the
question that you ask

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00:10:08,261 --> 00:10:11,861
yourself is, what is
dialogue doing in my story.

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00:10:11,861 --> 00:10:15,371
If you're trying to write
the kind of story which

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00:10:15,371 --> 00:10:22,151
wants to say to the reader, this
is as real as I can make it,

212
00:10:22,151 --> 00:10:26,411
this is a story which
is like a slice of life,

213
00:10:26,411 --> 00:10:29,331
if you're trying to
write that kind of story,

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00:10:29,331 --> 00:10:30,021
then it's a good
idea to try and make

215
00:10:30,021 --> 00:10:31,211
then it's a good
idea to try and make

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00:10:31,211 --> 00:10:34,961
the characters sound as they
would sound in real life.

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00:10:34,961 --> 00:10:37,091
But if you're not trying
to write a slice of life,

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00:10:37,091 --> 00:10:41,506
if you're trying to do
something more highly invented,

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00:10:41,506 --> 00:10:42,881
then that doesn't
matter so much.

220
00:10:42,881 --> 00:10:45,941
If there's clearly
a level of departure

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00:10:45,941 --> 00:10:49,511
from everyday reality,
then the dialogue

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00:10:49,511 --> 00:10:50,741
can be a departure as well.

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00:10:50,741 --> 00:10:53,206
[MUSIC PLAYING]

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Spoken language
has speech rhythms.

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00:10:59,551 --> 00:11:00,021
And you want to find
the speech rhythm

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00:11:00,021 --> 00:11:02,671
And you want to find
the speech rhythm

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00:11:02,671 --> 00:11:07,531
that best suits the character
that you're creating.

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00:11:07,531 --> 00:11:11,111
Some characters
are very articulate

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00:11:11,111 --> 00:11:14,741
and speak in long,
flowing sentences.

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00:11:14,741 --> 00:11:20,441
Some characters speak in much
shorter bursts, little staccato

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00:11:20,441 --> 00:11:21,621
bursts of sentences.

232
00:11:21,621 --> 00:11:23,626
And so the way in
which they speak

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00:11:23,626 --> 00:11:25,001
tells you quite
a lot about them.

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00:11:25,001 --> 00:11:28,931
So that's something to think
about when you're representing

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00:11:28,931 --> 00:11:30,021
how a character speaks.

236
00:11:30,021 --> 00:11:30,441
how a character speaks.

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00:11:30,441 --> 00:11:34,181
One of the difficulties that
I had in some of the books

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00:11:34,181 --> 00:11:39,261
that I've written which
deal with South Asia

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00:11:39,261 --> 00:11:42,711
is that the characters
would not realistically

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00:11:42,711 --> 00:11:45,951
be speaking English, they would
be speaking other languages.

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00:11:45,951 --> 00:11:50,591
And yet I have to represent
that speech in English.

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00:11:50,591 --> 00:11:53,511
So the question then
is, how do you do that?

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00:11:53,511 --> 00:11:57,521
English speakers' idioms that
can sound completely idiotic

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coming out of their mouths.

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So you have to create an idiom.

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So you have to create an idiom.

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You have to create what's
called an idiolect, which

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is a way for them to
speak, for their speech

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to be represented in English
which indicates to the reader

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that this is, if you
like, a translation

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from another language.

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That's one of the
hardest things,

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I think, to do is to
represent in one language

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something that's actually
being said in another language.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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There are writers
who take great pain

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to make sure that
their characters speak

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as people would in real life.

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If you read the short stories
of Raymond Carver, for example,

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his characters are predominantly
working class, often very poor

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indeed, often with
problems of drink.

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And he had an amazing ear for
the accurate representation

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And he had an amazing ear for
the accurate representation

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of the speech of people of that
class and that time and place.

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So in the case of
Ray Carver, yes, I

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think his characters speak
as they would if they

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were in the room with you.

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In the case of
other writers, no.

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Writers develop
conventions of speech.

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If you read the great American
novelist Don DeLillo--

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I think maybe Don
DeLillo may be, I think,

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the greatest living
American novelist.

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All the characters speak
in exactly the same way.

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All the characters speak
in exactly the same way.

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All the characters have
exactly the same tone of voice.

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And that tone of
voice is deliberately

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flattened, unemotional.

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It's quite clear that he's
doing that on purpose,

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that he's trying to create
a world in which there

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is very little affect.

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The people's ability to
emotionally communicate

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with each other is withdrawn.

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People speak in
this very flat way.

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00:14:00,021 --> 00:14:00,801
People speak in
this very flat way.

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So in the case of
DeLillo's characters,

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no, I don't think people
like that would speak

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like that if you met them.

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And in other people's work,
writing can be very heightened.

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So if we talk about, like,
Alice Walker, Toni Morrison,

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they're very influenced also by
a kind of biblical tradition,

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almost like Old
Testament, almost

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00:14:22,881 --> 00:14:30,021
like sermons, given a kind
of poetic heightening.

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like sermons, given a kind
of poetic heightening.

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Again, yeah, people
don't talk like that.

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But you believe it
because it comes out

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of a tradition of speech
which has to do with church

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and with all kinds of elements
which come from that culture.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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Just as an exercise,
try and write

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a scene in which you
don't say who's talking.

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And show it to somebody.

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00:14:58,521 --> 00:15:00,021
And see if they can
distinguish the characters,

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00:15:00,021 --> 00:15:00,721
And see if they can
distinguish the characters,

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00:15:00,721 --> 00:15:02,304
even if the characters
are just called

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00:15:02,304 --> 00:15:06,081
A, B, and C. See
if somebody can say

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00:15:06,081 --> 00:15:07,791
who's talking at which moment.

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If you've really understood
how they each speak,

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00:15:12,531 --> 00:15:17,571
then the reader will know who's
talking without your telling

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00:15:17,571 --> 00:15:23,631
them because only that
character would speak like that,

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00:15:23,631 --> 00:15:26,751
and only this character
would speak like this.

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And it can be, for example,
that one character speaks

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00:15:30,021 --> 00:15:32,141
And it can be, for example,
that one character speaks

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in a more didactic way, is
always telling you what to do

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00:15:36,621 --> 00:15:38,411
and what they think
and why you're wrong

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00:15:38,411 --> 00:15:39,461
and why you're right.

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00:15:39,461 --> 00:15:44,231
And another character might
be more timid in the way

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that they speak.

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It's a craft skill.

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And it's something
you can polish

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00:15:50,561 --> 00:15:55,571
and you can get better at
because it will help you.

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Differentiation is
what it's called.

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If you could properly
differentiate

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00:16:00,021 --> 00:16:02,441
If you could properly
differentiate

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00:16:02,441 --> 00:16:06,581
the way in which each character
acts, speaks, behaves,

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00:16:06,581 --> 00:16:09,821
then they exist on the
page without you having

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00:16:09,821 --> 00:16:11,571
to spell it out all the time.

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00:16:11,571 --> 00:16:14,801
And so it's worth
practicing differentiation.

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[MUSIC PLAYING]